Seraphim: Which part of my summary is incorrect then, as simply as possible? Also, you said:"the interplay between order and chaos defines all activity on earth in terms of energy.".. How does this relate to free will?
defender of truth
JoinedPosts by defender of truth
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754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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defender of truth
"That’s not quite the way I would put it but almost yes, kind of."
Yes or no? Thanks. -
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Public Speaker Cries During His Talk
by James Jackson inhis talk was about reaching out for the real life.. he is in his mid seventies, then begins to rant on about staying loyal to the organization because many of us have lost loved ones in death and if we want to see them again we must remain in the organization.
he says he wants to see his father again, then the tears begin to flow right there on the stage.... then an elderly sister during the watchtower study admits to regetting leaving her daughter behind to seek a better life in the u.s, and she is crying.... these 2 meetings was just plain weird..
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defender of truth
Wing Commander..
[img]http://1.bp.blogspot.com/--a_dDvKhui8/TmU4ZZXKipI/AAAAAAAAAkA/DS7n7r7py5A/s1600/CyberHug-1.jpg[/img] -
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A place called BETHEL: Footnote from WT 2014 April 15
by Bob_NC ini do know a place where "in?delity on the part of one or both mates, homosexuality, behavioral problems, aggression, anxiety, depression, or suicidal tendencies" occur.. it is a group home where several thousand young single men live together communal style.
the eat, sleep, work, and recreate in communal groups.
they rarely mingle outside the communal group.
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754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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defender of truth
Seraphim said: "The sun keeps things running on the earth but it will cool eventually and with it all life, including good and bad for earth."
.. Okay, am I getting all of this straight?
You believe that God:
left the earth and mankind to evolve to this point, with random suffering and death from natural disasters for people and animals being absolutely necessary for them to survive and have free will, He rescues some people and animals from disaster yet not others, and will in the future leave the Sun to cool and life to die out on earth?
I'd just like a tidy summary for those just joining us. Thanks. -
754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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defender of truth
Seraphim said: "Defender of truth I wasn’t derailing the conversation with that question but alas we shall never know what my point would have been if I had been given an answer and for you to be able to judge how relevant it would have been. Rest assured it would have been!"
.. It was your accusation that was derailing, or heading that way. There should never be a need to make a provoking statement, or to ask a personal question in a discussion like this one. And to ask about whether someone has kids, directly after saying that they seem to like suffering, is either heading in a very provocative direction, or incredibly daft. You don't strike me as the latter.
You could still say 'if you had children, would you..', or whatever your point was in relation to God allowing suffering. -
754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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defender of truth
Caedes, as to what seraphim meant by so called 'natural disasters', he said on page 16: "I guess I would define a natural disaster by the affect an exterior natural event has on people in terms of pain, suffering and death. So unless an earthquake actually affects [people for ill], it isn’t a natural disaster."
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watchtowers army assault on our vulnerable elderly in nursing homes
by friendaroonie inits been a long time since i have been this enraged at the evilness and shameless exploitation by the jws.
i just got back from the meeting (dont ask) and sat through the km article laying out plans to mass convert nursing homes all over the world.
i am not going to labor the obvious ethical travesty of this plan but i will say that it constitutes a major public health risk.
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defender of truth
Thanks Flipper, it's really nice to hear about such proactive ways of helping the elderly, at least while they're laughing they are not just sat there vegitating. I need a stiff whiskey after going into some nursing homes, I find them more depressing than funerals or cemetaries, the level of care is sickening at times.. Anywho, cheers for the encouragement;)
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Disturbing Footnote in Tomorrow's Study Article...
by HeyThere inarticle is basicqlly about families where a spouse is working away from home for an extended period, etc...a foot note says basically that some studies have shown that working away from home can cause serious consequences, such as infidelity, homosexuality, or incest.
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pull it up on jw.org...that is what it says.
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defender of truth
"Wild_Thingposteda day ago(6/22/2014)
Post656of685
Joined7/9/2002
Marking in case someone finds a link to the these supposed "studies". "
This person's post motivated me. Also, I thought that it may be of interest to try and find a source. Don't worry, I won't be wasting another second of my time or yours trying to be helpful.
Back on topic..
Excellent reasoning from Oubliette. -
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watchtowers army assault on our vulnerable elderly in nursing homes
by friendaroonie inits been a long time since i have been this enraged at the evilness and shameless exploitation by the jws.
i just got back from the meeting (dont ask) and sat through the km article laying out plans to mass convert nursing homes all over the world.
i am not going to labor the obvious ethical travesty of this plan but i will say that it constitutes a major public health risk.
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defender of truth
He agreed that someone should write a letter. I typed my letter out on a crappy old phone and posted it to help others. I then even sent a pm to let him know I had done as had been suggested. I have had no response, either in the thread or by pm. Maybe it's my upbringing or culture, but to me it is the height of rudeness to completely ignore someone. I'd rather be told 'look mate, your letter stinks, your idea stinks, but thanks anyway'. That I can deal with.He's been posting on JWN plently since then, it's not as though he has not been active. And don't tell me to get off my high horse, who do you think you are? Only 3 days ago, he and one or two other people (I've pm'ed all of them) sounded motivated and ready to do something about an issue they were concerned. Now, when I suggest something solid that might make a difference, it's *crickets*. There are many empty words spoken on this forum, that is what I have learnt. This threads done anyway.
